IRE Asks: If emotes earned experience, would your grin become a grind?

Roleplay rooster meme

Throughout MMORPG history, the highest level is typically attained through the process known as grinding.  I'm sure we're all familiar with grinding so we'll spare the definition, but it's interesting to note that the concept of grinding has not changed since its inception. Character and skill progression in video games tends to go one of two ways; either you spend long hours dungeon grinding to level up and put points into a skill tree. Or you spend long hours chopping wood to raise your Strength stat, jumping off rooftops to raise Acrobatics, then take a nice hour-long nap.


Grinding in its current form isn't due to go anywhere for a long time, having just as many defenders as detractors. However, some speculate that social rewards, or "roleplay XP", could be an alternative. Earning experience points for participating in MMO roleplay events would allow the social creatures to progress along with the grinders, enhancing the player driven world. If such a concept were introduced to Iron Realms, would you drop your sword and become the town crier? The local barman? Or would you still quest for glory in the underground catacombs?


Comment below!


Interesting because in Achaea, players are called "adventurers" and NPCs are average, every day people (town crier, barman). I think it explains that when your character goes through the Flame of Creation. So I wouldn't necessarily like to see players dropping their day-jobs of killing orcs and goblins to fill the NPC roles without some kind of retcon on that.

Otherwise it could be pretty cool considering you can lose roleplay points for being OOC.

Very interesting points.










But seriously, I happen to love the idea of a small trickle of experience for things like complex emotes, tmotes, prepended emotes, basically anything that requires thought, then action, as a way of creating a dynamic character.  Interactions would become more meaningful, as newbies find themselves gaining experience just from making friends and "being themselves."   


Maybe roleplay pregnancy will finally have some relevance!  Newbie areas will no longer be afflicted with 80 year-old, naked sirens looking for some fun. 


Better yet, make the "hardcore", "permanent death" option a feature within the roleplay spectrum.  Want to die a permanent death from a ritual gone horribly wrong?  Now you can!  

For some reason, the first thing I thought after reading this article was "dragon sex-alts", too.



But naked 200 year old sirens are the draw of hte game sir!

Tekla's not a sir

As far as you know.



Good times

as they grow older, do they taste better, like fine wine?

Old woman are like fine whine.

No kidding they are HOOOT!

boo! text nakedness is not a draw at all


I get it for telling stories, which is nice!


One of the best things in MkO

Thanks for pointing out this article. Some people grin a lot with friends, this would be fun! AND ROLEPLAY FEATURING MARRYING A DENIZEN. no really, this would be neat!

Didnt some player marry a god and then the god was punished years back? I forget all the details, back then, I was a newbie in Achaea, and Lusternia was born. In any case, that must have been scandal!!

I vaguely remember that too. But if you're marrying an NPC, perhaps it would be less of a big deal.


ohhhhh... scandal!

God-mortal marriages are the stuff of legends!

Hmm, marrying a denizen. Which one would you like to marry, Nixxe? :p


Just marry the biggest meanie there is, send him/her into battle.

or they just sit around waiting for you to fetch them a beer.



Related to a denizen? :D

probably, if you have a tendency to say things over and over.

If this were true, yes, it stands the chance to improve the quantity if not the quality of roleplaying in any game. Maybe put a limit of some sort on it so it doesn't turn into dragonsexalts. *titter*


I will have to agree with that one. I know far too many people who could be ranked #1 in experience just from emotesex alone.

i can agree with that

the worst kind of sex there is, in my opinion.

That's why the gain should be minimal, since it's such an accessible source of experience.  Likewise, it should not be in effect for pre-existing emotes.  Otherwise you'll get folks just spamming BOW at everyone that walks by, and even then, those folks would be shut down pretty fast by other adventurers who are getting sick of witnessing this blatantly weak form of characterization. 


I do bow a lot with a little bit of characterization. I am not sure it is a good thing now!

Would still be weird to implement just custom emote = exp, because it's still spammable.

That would be auto-emoting, and while it seems quite a ridiculous term, it would certainly be punished with shrubbing.



I recall when two people had it reflexed to bow to whoever bowed/curtsey to them. One of them bowed to the other one, and so they were spamming bow back and forth thanks to their reflexes -_- 


haha that woulda been a sight to behold.

That would've been great to see.


Man, it's like every DM/GM/Storyteller's worst nightmare: people suddenly being rewarded for mundane crap like being modest to another player in hopes of something easy. It'd have to be random, but if there was a big event going on and you got really into it, then I could see it (or maybe a few bound credits) being handed out as a reward.

One way that could improve the quantity and the quality of the roleplaying is to encourage it with some sort of ranking system or a dynamic honours line. Isn't that one of the reasons why people try to explore as many rooms as they can? By not tying it to experience gain, it'll encourage people who want to roleplay to do so more frequently and we won't be inundated with grin-grinders and sparkle-spammers.


XP for emotes is just going to lead to spam... and so is an honours line, honestly.


This. Exactly this.

Yeah, I agree, this will probably just cause people to spam for experience/honors/whatever. And I feel like there've gotta be more creative ways to deal with the grind... maybe like increasing the xp rewards of quests? I dunno.

people spam them in MMOs, so they'd do it here.

yes, i can sadly see this being abused easily.

Exactly. Having xp for emotes or honors lines would lead to a lot of spam. 

You'd most likely get more quantity of roleplay and not more quality roleplay with this.  notion.

This. Quality trumps quantity, even if the quantity can sometimes be alarmingly slim sometimes.

Agreed.  Some form of advancement from use of emotes would be interesting, but if there's XP gain it should come from reaching milestones rather than each and every use.

I doubt it would improve the quality of roleplaying.

I agree, but I don't think I would mind this.

...then I think it would be a really cool idea. Although, people should get significantly less experience from emotes than through hunting, so that people don't cease bashing altogether.

Perhaps the more people in the room, the more experience gained through roleplaying? Otherwise there might be a trend where people sit in front of mirrors alone all day and make faces.

the moment people start seeking out the most "experienced" whores. really cracks me up. Like you said, the dragon sexalts might become common.


"Wow, must've taken a lot of hunting to reach dragon!"

"Nah, not really! I never left my bed!"

that is disturbing

Could put in an experince cap for how many times you get experience for a single emote, so you can perform sparkle a few times, before reaching the cap. To that end it would discourage spam.

More likely (and something I've seen implemented in other MU*s is that there are "pulses" at regular intervals, and anyone that had done a custom emote of at least a certain length durint the interval gained a small amount of experience based on both their current level and the number of other people in the room.

I agree with ya'll, would be cool if you could get a tad bit of XP doing complex emotes, tmotes, and more if these emotes where not just some..what did Telka say..a 80 year old siren looking for some fun. 

At least you'd get them out of Minia.



Lusternia has influencing as a way to earn experience instead of bashing. Does that count?

Because it's a skillset which requires invested lessons, and it's only useful on denizens. 

but I heard Lusternia has a cool territory control system


In a way, yes.

Not really. Influencing is basically just bashing, reskinned.

It's not impossible. I know other MUDs do something similar.

I also read "The town barman." as "The town batman.".

I'm..... Barman.



then get back to work, I need a drink!



so did I.

But seriously, some MUDs make it so you need to submit roleplay logs to be able to get some form of recognition/xp from it. That can actually filter out good RP from lousy ones or inappropriate ones. Maybe filling up the scarlattan theatre roleplay logs section!

of a nerd do you have to be that the first thing that comes to mind on seeing this article is:

"Gyronny of 8, Argent and Gules, a chicken's head erased"



If you're allowing non-standard colours, sanguine's a closer fit.


Gee, thanks Tarkor, now I'm never going to see pictures like that in the same way again.

credit where credit is due!

Mmm, credit


But nah I am not very social

Yes I grin and emote alot! It would be absolutely awesome to have a roleplaying event... dunno how that would work out, but perhaps one could be expected to emote in a certain way in response to a certain scenario? Very interesting concept indeed! I feel we do need a system that teaches us the different emotes better... most people use the most obvious and simple emotes such as griinning, smiling and laughing because they are the ones we can remember most and in the back of my mind I find I am always thinking that I want to look through and try the huge list of other emotes available. I have noticed hardly anyone uses them at all! I think this is because most people do not really bother to memorize the other emotes and go through them.  I can say the same for myself though. Many ideas can grow from this concept to make roleplaying more intense.

Perhaps something similar to the setup Aetolia has? You can search for particular emotes with EMLIST and view individual ones without having to test it using EMSHOW.


As for the idea of gaining experience for emoting well, all I have to say is that I just don't see it happening. It's an interesting concept, but one with far too many inherent loopholes to make implementing it practical. There's always going to be killjoys with too much time on their hands and a will to game the system.

Ha! Yup

::Bakstabba farts and blames it on Genomin::

Not a good idea.

It's be cool, but I only sometimes do custom emotes. I think it would, in the end, be too hard to deal with mechanicwise.

This would be a horrifying idea...but it might be nice to see some new, different emotes used.

Called tasks/achievement in Imperian.

I think Aetolia has nothing like that...

I believe, those D&D type MUSH/MUXs where they roll dices in their actions to see if it would be possible, and it really is just hardcore roleplaying and their system calculates post length and etcetera in order to provide experience. It would be interesting in IRE, but we're almost always technicalities > RP a lot of the time.

For example, I wanted to stay an elfen Harbinger in Glomdoring for Lusternia, but if I really wanted to be eventually - one day long, long off - a top tier combatant, my best chances were as a shadowsinger faeling. It's the specialized race, higher intelligence and charisma and most of the domoth blessings are on them - which makes up for its downsides.

But yes, though it seems interesting as this would promote RP in general, it really wouldn't work mechanism-wise. I could just abuse it and emote all that I want by myself, and I feel like the says and/or emotes and such would have to be policed. This seems a bit... iffy for me. 

(Y'know disgruntled players, we like to trashtalk the admin sometimes. >_>)



wtb bitchnuts.


as neat as the concept sounds, i feel it would be really difficult to hardcode. I mean, whose to say what classfies as valid RP, and how do you decide what things earn how many points?


wingin it I suppose


I think it would take actual monitors to determine what is and what is not acceptable. But in all fairness you cannot say that the system would be abused if created, because that is an obvious truth. All systems are, by someone, at some point. As soon as certain people know how a system works...abuse.

I'd use it in combination with bashing and influencing so I'd never get burned out from doing one thing all the time.


I am with you on this one.  Variety is king!

same here, it would nice to have other choices and other things to do. 

it will just lead to a lot of players running around like they have nerve damage.

Not sure how this would be measured or valued, it would probably just lead to some folks overusing emotes...which is not the same thing.

Can't see this ever being a good idea.

Some would reach lvl 99/100 with it!

Carlin has never been the biggest PvPer and I do get bored of hunting as fast as possible, and only really do it to get lessons, which I've now started to put into trade skills. I love RP elements, being a scholar or a guide, a teacher, mentor, or even a protege. I love romance triangles, or political coups, or guild progression, and I think opening up something like town crier or barman or something that would allow roleplay experiences and roleplay experience points.

I think this could be alot of fun, but you'd have to be actually advancing some portion of the game in your rp... you can't get exp from just rping that you hate an enemy city or such, it would have to be something new and orginial. That said, it'd be awesome if you got some exp for, say, being on the council for your house, city, or in an order

I would then be able to get experience for my magical accidents (I like to try things I am not ready for).


Because it won't happen. Unless you consider things like achievements/tasks which already exists..


Kind of an odd idea but one I think could be interesting to take advantage of.

One of my favorite emotes is one that I created to honour the Twin Lords. I am a devout follower of Evil. If I gained experience for performing something that I ought to do just because then I think it would lose its meaning. And really, how much experience does a lip purse give?


you could up the ante to stick out :)

One of my favorite emotes is one that I created to honour the Twin Lords. I am a devout follower of Evil. If I gained experience for performing something that I ought to do just because then I think it would lose its meaning. And really, how much experience does a lip purse give?


Finally, I don't have to code my own personal achievement point system to get satisfaction from mudsex


But more denizen-character interactions, please!

Why talk when you can get xp emoting?  It would be the death of conversation.


You forget that you can talk in the middle of emotes, which means that conversation wouldn't disappear at all. I, personally, like the idea of having emotes bring in XP -- it opens up the game to a larger player base and makes it easier for non-combatants, like myself, to rise up in levels instead of having to leech off of others when they go hunting to grind away the millions of XP necessary to gain a new level.

I know plenty of people who would want to play IRE games more if there were other ways to gain XP instead of just bashing.

The problem with "grinding" (for those who dislike it) isn't that it leaves the RPers out, it's that it involves doing the same thing over and over.  Adding one more way to gain XP would be useful for the less combatative (by which I include combat against NPCs) characters, but wouldn't really create an alternative to grinding, just another way to grind.  Werin in particular is not a very social individual, so he'd still probably get the majority of his XP from bashing.

I would courtsey at everything.

I would courtsey at everything.

And twice, it seems.

Yes! Give me RP Xp. Exploration XP. XP for talking to people and not playing Achaea in single player mode ( Like alot of grinders, and people, do )

Ooh, I like the idea of exploration xp! Even if only a minor thing.


No one noticed the mention of xp for "mmo roleplay events" meaning no, you can't just spam grin, you have to take part in events to gain roleplay xp, and I think this could be implimented fantastically, but really, I wonder what kind of events would count.

Yeah the title of this article doesn't really match the content of it, which is rather more reasonable.

I wish more people would actually read these and comment on the content instead of mashing the reply button with as little thought as possible to get a credit.


Then again, there are a lot of actual articles here that seem sort of uninteresting, not that I think I could do better.

I think doing things that require skill as well should be compensated in experience.  Such as runing, or toteming for a Runewarden, forging as well.  Sure give experience for emoting, but there are skills out there that could use a little reward for being done, instead of being considered a minor annoyance to some.  At least let it be something someone wants to do, not only for their fellow citizens such as Runing, but something they will get back and not just in gold.

How much xp would an emote be worth? When you take into account that killing a mob can be worth over 100k - how could you scale an emote to be worth something to someone at level 80+ while not making it grant too much xp to someone at level 5?

I think the idea is a good one, just i think itnll be abused if made to easy.i think if it was implimented, they should do like they did for fishing in MKO.  You can only gai.n a certain amount of xp every day.  This way, people will still be adavancing in level if thier not bashers but keep things fair.  if they wish more xp for thier daily limit, go pick up a blade and bash something.


MKO has some cool ideas.

It could provide an interesting variation in how people gain they're endgame. I know lot of people talk about the ''private-roleplay," but really it's not worth making fun of. Really it's the decsions made that impact that sort of thing. It could boost experience and encourage 'overall,' roleplay in the right setting. Honestly, I don't care what happens behinds closed doors, just as long as you keep your OOC seperate from your IC, and it's the really your business. *shrug*


Though, I can see the flaws that could be warranted from roleplay experience, it might be a good idea to at least do a trial run for those people who actually DO roleplay outside of the bedroom.


it is an interesting idea...but lets get emotes in tells first.

Let's not get emotes in tells, please. :( Understanding that someone is probably rolling their eyes at me from across the continent because the tone of their tell is snide, or because I know them well enough to know that they roll their eyes a lot is more interesting than a bit of code that tells me so.

No...aweful idea...


I love the idea, I think it would be nigh on impossible to implement.

There should also be a loss of xp...the same way as if one dies...

In any case, I might become hysterical if Lus does that...seriously.


The Influence system


depends on how it would work out. In Imperian it works quite well since its a one time thing and hardly any exp.

this is probably the best way it would work.

It would be pretty cool to earn experience for RPing, but it would be difficult to pull off fairly in a way that did not promote a lot of... well, trash RP. See Bluji's post. Also, earning experience this way would encourage a lot of people to attempt to force their way into major events that really have nothing to do with them (as if they don't already try to). So, figuring out how that might work would be a task unto itself and would likely necessitate a lot of admin involvement.


Perhaps I'm in the minority, but it would also be fun to let players fill some NPC roles. For instance, letting them run their own bars and such. They would have to procure resources (food, furniture, booze), stock the establishment, maybe even hire other players to help them run it and pay them a small wage. Doing something like this requires that the owner of the establishment interact with many different people (his suppliers, his customers, his employees) and would hopefully create an environment with lots of RP opportunities, one in which gaining experience from RP might be a little more feasible.

While cool in concept it would be pretty hard to put technically (and equitably) into practice.  The only thing I can really think of is something like the Aetolian esteem system, except expanding it so that players built up esteem points which gave minimal xp (or maybe an xp% boost?). 


Still... Friends would be able to esteem friends up so it could very easily be abused.

Would be cool but like others said it would be rather to implement I think.

I say leave events for those that enjoy them and ruin them with experience gain.  The crowd for an event is already large enough.


I think it would end up either very elitist or very spammy.


Even assuming that limits are put in place to prevent emote spamming purely for leveling up I have to wonder: Why should RP earn experience? Isn't RP supposed to be it's own reward?


Also, so far as I am aware, the only thing that experience affects is how well you do in combat, and doesn't really have much of an effect on how you RP. (i.e a demigod has the same ability to RP as a lvl1 Noob).

There are skills out there that aren't meant for combat. You need lessons to learn a trade skill as well, which is far more RP than combat. Among other reasons I'm currently too lazy to post on.


But no, yeah, I think this would be a difficult idea.


I shall reiterate...??

(This is just to get a credit obviously)

Xp is way too hard to get just bashing. Expecially with people who do more then play games in single player mode.

More options to gain exp? yes please.


Everyone likes XP


We do!

but it would REALLY need work, to make it viable.

Yes, I can picture it...
emote "Keelase smiles at the idea."
So-and-so emotes "So-and-So thinks about how stupid u r."
emote "Keelase thinks this is stupid."
So-and-So emotes "So-and-so thinks this is stupid. Hey! It's experience!"



i'm torn. part of me sees how it can be awesome to give an alternative to getting Xp, but part of me agrees that it is just problems waiting to happen.

Something tells me that Mhaldor would becomes a more expressive place...

haha funneh


remember when the lol emote was banned?

uhh, no it's not

yes!!! But only ooc. :P

Whatever emotes are fo people who cant fight

I don't see the relation.

emotes arnt for lol'nub dickfaces. Please be careful about emoting around a lol'alt. It may rageslash your face off for its blantant disragard of RP. 

at all

Yes I'll just log on and grin a lot!

thats it

This isn't plausible.

Could work with a daily exp cap.

..make it where the only individuals whom benefit from the experience gain be in the higher levels (90's maybe?) to not promote dragon sex alts. 

Have fun with that

An alternative to gaining experience would be nice, and I like the idea of having a daily cap...but i think it would be a bit problematic and would have many cons, like ones already mentioned by others.


and kinda silly


I like things like they are in this matter.

Giving XP for roleplay (rather than only for killing stuff) works in D&D where there's a real person, the DM, making the call. But the very nature of RP is that it can't be graded mechanically.

If each emote will earn soo little experience that people will just not really pay attention to it, like when killing much weaker denizens..


I don't want to advance being the local barman. I want to advance by being the local BATman. I don't play these games to be mundane.

As an adventurer, I already play many roles: warrior, tradesman, mentor, jester, shopkeeper, etc.

RP is just one of those things that cannot be easily quantified or codified, very subjective. Good luck finding a way to reward the RPers in a manner that does not require constant oversight and is not subject to abuse!

We can make a book on people who we know that will find some way to abuse it


Experience for custom emotes makes more sense. Using premade emotes for experience would be ..*shudder*   Would love to see more defined ways to have mini story lines between players. I have to confess I have spent too much time alone on islands hunting to make it to dragon, sometimes I talk to the denizens just to break up the monotony.  Who hasn't want to tell the gnolls.." of course I fight like a girl. I am one."

I DO tell them that.

how on earth could you come up with some system to separate what is "good" roleplay from "bad"? it's simple to sit in one spot with any random group of people and spam stupid custom emotes all day, and not any more fun or interesting than grinding a dungeon






The best feature of this article is the graphic, of which I wholly approve.

You know, I actually tried that once? I was bored.

Achievement / Newbie task for this already. Won't net you much though.

....people will do it repetitively.  Thats just the way it is.  Giving small amounts of exp for good RP would be an awesome way to reward people who are great at RP.  But it would be very time intensive for the staff, since automating it would be pretty much impossible, in my opinion.  Good article.

Great, I can level from Mooing

It would be interesting if you could do what they do in some other games, if you do a good RP you can submit it to a Demi-God or whatever and they review it and award points. Thereby you'd get exp or maybe even a credit if it was good enough.

It would be a sad day when Cyrenian snugglers sitting at CC reach dragon from "RP" experience.

would have to be custom emotes and at least one other person there without being able to use the same exact emote over and over >.>


why did the word 'custom' link to another article? So shifty :O

Well yeah it is actually a lame way to gain experience but RP events for rewards would be better.


I would like it if Achaea's credibility system, for example, was both a positive and negative scale with benefits (like more experience, gold drop rates etc).


I'd guess it's so hard to implement, though!

From what I remember about the credibility system, it seemed somewhat arbitrary. I got my credibility knocked when I first started playing, because I said help file instead of scroll. 

The only way I could see this working is in events when the admin sortof  look over our shoulders. and award rp exp for participating. 


Otherwise Ithink it'd be hard to standardise what constitutes  rp and how much exp one gets. for participating. I just see eager abuse of this implimented and disgruntled people because they thought they deserved more than they god.

oh great, now the snuggles can match up with people like Penwize

I like how in Midekemia you gain experience for exploring places as well as fishing. I wish you could do that in Achaea as well. It's nice to get experience for things other than just bashing stuff and the occasional quest.


Interesting idea. I think it'd be better at events though, rather than with everyday emotes

I'd grind me up some nod XP

This is a terrible question.


I think it's a great concept, but it'd require -a lot- of monitoring and algorithms to make it so people can just sit in some remote corner of the world and "grin" a thousand times in 5 seconds to get 1% experience.  I think the concept of Roleplay-experience is one to be considered. Deeply considered, for it's a great idea that will make people who want more RP but it's hard to get people to do it.  I get that problem a lot.

But don't people RP for the fun of RP? why do you need an 'incentive' for Role Playing in a Role Playing game?

Well-made point.

If I could get xp I would emote all day long.

alot of people would.

If they were long, descriptive, but somehow not retarded emotes, I guess that would be okay.

I want more xp

Me too.

I think it would be an interesting addition. There should definitely be another dimension to gaining experience, as constant fighting wouldn't really enhance your character as a person.

I love the influence system, even if I never had the credits there to do it much, or well


I would love to see experience given for good RP! But I think that it would be too easy to abuse and because of that impractical.

And we would have to deal with auto emoters :)


1. Config timeout 1

2. reflex: You will TIMEOUT in 1 minute unless you do something.

3. trigger: send("dance")

4. ???

5. Profit!


Because he figures out you're AFK and snaps you!!

Yeah, that plan is just... unwise, to say the least.



You're not supposed to discourage them.


I was wondering how it would be possible to keep people from abusing this.

I'd be doing squat-thrusts with rather large, triangular weights room to room as i walked emoting on the go! Completely stark naked letting the world see my naked glory through every city as i sing manly songs about lumberjacks and pancakes!


Yes, yes! It would be so glorious!  Then I played midkemia and did this through city of sar-sagoth.

aka Sar-soggysocks ^^

one-to-one relationship between emotes and XP would result in immediate abuse unless you set the ratio so low that it's a novelty more than anything.


Monitored roleplay to be evaluated for XP would run into the same issues with crafting.  Someone sits there and evaluates.  The standards won't be universally applicable, so it will become judgement calls that no one will be really happy with.


That said, if there were a crafting like system to create roleplay like devices -- custom emotes, rituals, etc that people got XP for crafting well and some really small amount when other people used them might have some potential.  But it would still be ugly from the standpoint of even evaluation and judgement.

That could be fun. :) Bashing is rough at level 80ish. So slow!

Quite frankly I just think it could be too easily abused to be a feasible thing to put in. I do really like the idea of gaining something from actual roleplay (as a preacher and ritualist ICly it'd be a great boon for me) but I just see it as becoming to complex of an issue to be worth the effort it would take any admin to put together and then actually have to monitor and tweak amounts etc.

I am playing to roleplay and i don't know the first thing about combat.

While it may seem like a better idea to only have experience given for custom emotes and the like, this may cause more problems than it's worth. I know some people who are simply not good at custom emoting in character. I suppose if the gain is very small, it would be more of a "side" reward and not the main point.  Just a small bonus.

I agree with genomin, there are too many out there who simply can't custom emote. traditional emoting would be over used and abused quickly. while custom emoting would encourage all the mud-sex fiends, as a result I feel we could be walking a dangerous path in politics and combat. it would be a shame if all our strongest characters in the game were suddenly the pervy few who hide in their manse's all day gettin busy. lol

Yes. Oh my god, yes. I would love this.

If this went down I think we'd have a lot more dragons roaming around. Not that we don't have a lot already.

Definitely I would do some grinding


I hate grinding.

I would love to gain experience for every slight nod of acknowledgment and wry smile, but some how I don't see how a custom greeting unlocks a higher understanding or physical limit within us.

How about only count those e/t-motes that have spoken text in it, and please can we have it in quotes and in the SAY colour as Aetolia does?

If experience is to be added to any actions, it should be added to crafting, fishing, and/or sailing.

My grin would become a bump n grind...

of course

If you did introduce an xp reward for role playing I think you'd also see an increase in the number of Jesters, Bards and other potentialy role playing heavy classes.

Being a part-time player, I can't see how I would be able to fully dedicate myself to an NPC position to gain XP.  It makes more sense for a player like to me login, player for an hour or so, bash, and log off for the time being.  

It would be difficult maintaining a roleplaying "position".

I always wanted to explore RP, but the truth is, it depends a lot on having other people around, and that's not always available. Interesting RP is also very situation based, and when things get stale, it gets sorta hard. I think if xp were offered for it, I wouldn't do much more than I already do.

One of my favorite MUDs of all time (now shut down), had nearly all experience come from roleplaying. The lack of quality in roleplay is one of the primary reasons I inevitably disappear from IRE MUDs. SO MUCH COMBAT... RP? Oh, is that when you shout across the world that the leader of <opposing city> is a/an <explitive> that <past tense verb> his <relative>?


When I've seen this system in action, it usually works, if it's done right, and there's enough of a playerbase. My personal recommendation would be to have how public the room is have an effect on the experience earned, and perhaps as a more noticable effect, the number of people present and included. Maybe have the experience practically negligible if it's just two people somewhere in the woods, and completely gone if it's anywhere exceedingly private (homes, ships, manses, wilderness). Maybe a small boost in specific areas, such as at a Temple (with of course, Gods from any direction smiting anyone with the gonads to mudsex in these areas)

I played a MUD where you did nothing but RP. I think with the bashing and influencing added, it could work. Granted, only RP points in highly trafficed areas.

Mudsex, yep


Well.. erm.. right!

Maybe you could only be able to gain XP from emoting at certain times? 

Though roleplay should be rewarded, I'm not sure it's as simple as quantifying emotes/socials into EXP. Character characterization can be a subtle process.

I mean... agreed.

I disagree that there should just be some magical formula for converting roleplaying emotes into experience points, but I agree with the idea that roleplaying should be rewarded in some way.


A certain unnamed "most-popular" mmo has achievements for some emotes and tracks the stats of others (for example, how many hugs you've received). And yes, people grind it out with their alts.

I've played RPGs with RPAs (roleplay awards) which can be awarded by players to players with limitations. Any mechanically introduced reward would simply encourage people to metagame.




um I don't grin.


Yes it prolly would

it would become a game of mudsex.


I don't really like the idea of gaining experience by emoting. I'd rather earn dragon from bashing. I don't think it'd be fair to those who've already obtained dragon to have all these dragons pop up from emoting their way to it.

Worst idea yet. I can't even imagine the deterioration of already mediocre RP caused by all the spamming and stupid emotes.


I've actually been a staffer at an exclusively rp-xp MUD and I have to say it is a great way to develop depth in the character's lives.  Things seem more vibrant and doing anything in the world actually feels like it is meaningful.  There are drawbacks though which I'll quickly outline below.


RP xp allows players to progress without the need for combat. (Lusternia has a good mechanic in influence but even that still feels like a grind.  Emoting for xp isn't as much of a grind and in my mind would only work off of custom emotes rather than "smile" "frown" "hop" emotes.)

It helps create meaning to everyday things.

It rewards those who love to rp and gives them more incentive to do so more often.

It will encourage more immersion into the worlds you've worked hard to create.



Mudsexers... I've always thought it was funny when a couple would spend hours and hours mudsexing and then come out for a breath of air when they've maxed all the combat skills...

- (one way to stop this that my old staffleads used to use was to make "hotspots" where you'd gain MORE rp-xp when you were out in these public areas, IE: taverns, town square, ect..)

Balance: As with the above, are you going to reward a barkeep xp only to have him use that xp/lessons to build up combat skills? 

- (Personally, this is something I'm ok with.  Our characters have everyday lives to live as well which we suspend belief on, why not do so for those who choose a more mundane adventuring life?)

- (Another way to handle this might be to create some "RP" skillsets that would grant benefits to your rp-xp gain or the things you can do/create in rp.  A barkeeping ability for instance could be built up and some of the skills within that could create special buffs for those in rp around that player.  I see these being more of a mini-skill rather than a full-on skill.)

Direction: Sometimes, muds that use rp-xp lose the ability to create the needed conflict for rp.  Some people are great at creating it themselves but I think you'll need more volunteers strictly for rp purposes if you develop this idea in IRE muds.


All in all, I love rp-xp type games.  There is some amazingly deep rp that springs up from the minds of those who know they are being rewarded for good rp.  I also love mechanics that allow players/staff to reward other players for good rp.  Hope this helps spur on more conversation about this.  I'd love to see it added to IRE.


Looking over the other comments there are some really clever ways to tone down the spam-bots for xp.  One way is to limit the amount of rp-xp you can gain in a certain time-period. 


This is how our MUD did it:

-First off, all xp was based on the length and complexity of the emote.  I'm not a coder (I worked with the crafting/world design/rp areas) so I don't fully understand how they did it but I know that a 5 word emote got you 1-2 rp-xp where a paragraph would get you closer to 40-50 rp-xp.

-Next, there were other modifiers for your rp-xp that were based on the world.  I mentiond "hotspots" above where you'd get a 20% bonus to rp-xp because it was public and anyone could be involved.  This encouraged more interaction amongst the whole.

-Then there were bonuses based on how many people were in the room.  So 2 people wouldn't get a bonus at all where as 3 might get 2-3% and then upwards of another 20% depending on the amount of people.

-The last way mechanic we used to keep people honest was a reward/demotion system.  If we caught people doing stupid emotes just to get xp, we'd dock them a percentage of gain.  Similar to the rp reputation mechanic most IREs have now when they're checking for bot-bashing.

-And then there is the time mechanic.  This allowed people to keep up who didn't have hours on end each day to devote to solid rp time.

1st hour of play: Full xp for your emotes.

2nd hour of play:5% less xp

3rd hour of play: 7% less xp

ect. ect. ect. down to a cap of 50% at like 12 hours.


Again these are just ideas to help curb abuse.  Will there be abuse?  Probably.  I think though, those who are dismissing it off hand are the types that don't like to rp anyway.  I truly don't think that the xp rewards for emoting should be nearly as high as those for bashing/influencing/whathaveyou.  Nonetheless, this could be a great addition to IRE and would likely draw in far more customers looking for a solid MUD to play at.

Interesting! I think if this is ever considered, it would be an excellent idea to look at other games who already have this, learn from them and use it to create the best possible implementation.

Best contribution to this idea imo. Make it so!



yes it would

Doff doff.

One would have to make it more complex than grinning or you'll have 18 year old dragons in a heart beat...which then why bother hunting or questing... And I've seen what happens when "adventures" fall in love with the Divine or NCP's ...its never pretty, granted it adds a different dynamic but everyone knows that an ncp is puppeted and well marrying one would bring a deeper distraction from more meaningful things that need attention. I think the Divine in Achaea have enough to look after if you ask me.  However, if it was brought about in a more complex system instead of just set emotes already, or not extringuishing ncp duties then it'd be great.

IRE will find a way to even things out.

Ooh, it might be cool if there were some way to have someone rate you on your RPing, and gaining XP out of it...I guess guild rites in Lusty are kind of close, but it depends on the guild.

Could end up with senseless roleplay for the sake of gaining experience, though.


Perhaps if admin-monitored RP events on larger scales could be tallied for experience, that would be interesting to have. Though it might only serve as a conduit for senseless input that players think can pass off as stellar RP. Guild rites such as in Lusternia, I think, are enough of an option for gaining experience for RP.

I would like to gain XP for emoting or any other social interaction. I would give me another incentive to socialize around, I think

Not a hug fan of hunting and PvP, I'm a big socializer, so this would be AMAZING!


I agree. And especially since Achaea  has classes like Bard and Jester, those classes usually take up to more roleplaying than fightin, anyway, so it could reward them in some way. Would have to be obviously structured, for fear of are all things, of course. But I can honestly say it would raise my level of interest in the game considerably. 


Reminds me of what me and my friends do when we play D&D. Sometimes I give them entire, extensive, 4-5 hour roleplay "encounters" along with skill challenges, and even though they didn't use a lick of their powers, they still got plentiful experience equivalent to what they would have receieved via a combat encounter.



Is great for the Influence system.

I once decided, in Imperian, to complete the achievement for 250 emotes used. I will never do 250 emotes at once again.


no, but my sparlkey eyes might.

I am Bill Nighy, and I'm pretty sure emothing would be supported by the Aetolian playerbase.

I would not.

One of us!





Yeah that'd be the stuff...

There really doesn't need to be another grind mechanic.  Especially one that endorses people to use a certain emote a certain amount of times.  It would only lead to more annoyances with emotes than there already is.

I'd do it.. probably

Seems like this would just lead to annoying use of emotes


tons of crazy emo things..

Those would have to be some pretty emotes.


I'm worried about the grammar.


Yes it would



It could be interesting, if there was a limit to how much you could do. Like five emotes per day or something.

I don't like the sound of RP-XP at all......... I use emotes frequently, some too much (grin & laugh :P), but I get very frustrated if someone in the room with my character is emoting tons - its just spammy and annoying.


Maybe xp should be broken down more like Imperian - where you have a questing rank, hunting rank, <something else> rank (I only played it for a week, there were too few people to interact with!). The ranks averaged out into an overall level - and gave those who preferred questing as much of a chance as the 'grinders'.

I don't like the sound of RP-XP at all......... I use emotes frequently, some too much (grin & laugh :P), but I get very frustrated if someone in the room with my character is emoting tons - its just spammy and annoying.


Maybe xp should be broken down more like Imperian - where you have a questing rank, hunting rank, <something else> rank (I only played it for a week, there were too few people to interact with!). The ranks averaged out into an overall level - and gave those who preferred questing as much of a chance as the 'grinders'.

and an emote rank for rp effectiveness?

Would not.